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CBA update?
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TargetToad
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Joined: 31 May 2017
Location: Lutz, FL
PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:34 am    Post subject: CBA update? Reply with quote

Anyone have any updates on the CBA yet it expires in less than 2 weeks and it might be the only thing keeping guys like Joe Hills from getting money under the table to play for Jacksonville's and Arizona's farm leagues
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gigisa
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Location: Italy
PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I sure hope I'm wrong, but if you go to read Ivan Soto's tweets it does not look like there's a nice air Embarassed ... let's keep our fingers crossed Exclamation
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Firstnten.net
Ironman

Joined: 23 Jun 2011
PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gigisa wrote:
I sure hope I'm wrong, but if you go to read Ivan Soto's tweets it does not look like there's a nice air Embarassed ... let's keep our fingers crossed Exclamation


your not wrong Soto openly mocked Leonsis and the AFL for announcing tryouts.

Soto is a blood sucking scumbag, whose negotiation tactics lack any semblance of professionalism.

The only people reading his tweets are a handful of AFL player people running the AFL and maniacs like us who follow this "league".

It serves absolutely no purpose to publicly antagonize the league.

This just in Ivan the majority of sports fanatics in this country could care less about you the players of this league or the league itself.

So you kill the league with unreasonable demands. What next you go after the NAL, IFL or some other league that pays players 80 to 300 bucks a game? Where most franchises run at a loss?

You failed as an NFL agent. You stink as a rep for the AFLPU. How about you cut the negativity and tell the "public" your "reasonable demands" for the players. Show us how the current AFL is not treating players fairly instead of acting like a angry 13 year old at recess telling everyone that a bunch of clowns are running the AFL.

And the AFL does have a CBA until September 30th. Maybe they hope an agreement can be reached before the tryout dates. Obviously you don't think so. How does saying this publicly help the negotiations? Help other possible players to consider trying out making the league better? Or move the league is a positive direction which ultimately benefits the players? The very people YOU are supposed to represent.

WOW...right back at you fool...
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AFLNerd36
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Joined: 19 Jun 2016
PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could the AFLPU possibly kick Soto out and replace him?
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TargetToad
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Location: Lutz, FL
PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFLNerd36 wrote:
Could the AFLPU possibly kick Soto out and replace him?

Hopefully. If T.T. hasn't left the game yet, he could be a viable replacement, what with dealing with this in Tampa vs. Maricum and in Orlando vs. Gruden. Both the players and league love him, he's one of the most recognizable names in the AFL, the last Ironman-era guy left (not counting Mark Lewis and Josh Bush being on Tampa's practice squad), the oldest active receiver in American Football, tons of records, and he was Vince Carter's high school basketball teammate (for what ever that's worth).
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gigisa
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Black clouds coming in Sad

From Soto's Twitter
" Ivan F. Soto‏ @ISotoAFLPU 26 set
Strike power comes back in a week.."

Embarassed Rolling Eyes Embarassed
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afdave
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Joined: 01 Jan 2001
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Soto just needs to realize that, the league is not in a position to be bargained against in this "tough agent" way. Yes, there are deep pockets involved now on the ownership level, but, the deep pockets are in the other coats they wear.... the AFL coat has extremely shallow pockets, and they aren't going to give you access to the other coat... if you push too hard, they'll just burn the AFL coat and walk away. You need to work with them to help make the pockets of the AFL coat deeper, and then you can have more to negotiate on.
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Firstnten.net
Ironman

Joined: 23 Jun 2011
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

afdave wrote:
I think Soto just needs to realize that, the league is not in a position to be bargained against in this "tough agent" way. Yes, there are deep pockets involved now on the ownership level, but, the deep pockets are in the other coats they wear.... the AFL coat has extremely shallow pockets, and they aren't going to give you access to the other coat... if you push too hard, they'll just burn the AFL coat and walk away. You need to work with them to help make the pockets of the AFL coat deeper, and then you can have more to negotiate on.


The fact that this guy tantrums on twitter speaks for itself.
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mactheknife
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Joined: 03 Feb 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gigisa wrote:
Black clouds coming in Sad

From Soto's Twitter
" Ivan F. Soto‏ @ISotoAFLPU 26 set
Strike power comes back in a week.."

Embarassed Rolling Eyes Embarassed


If this guy thinks, for one minute, that a player strike will do anything but kill AFL 2.0, then the players have made a HUGE mistake in having him continue to represent them.

Given the current circumstances, I think the best they'd be able to do is get a two-year extension of their current deal, in order to reevaluate where things are going into 2020. If Ivan Soto thinks the AFLPU is going to make any substantive gains by striking or threatening to strike? I suspect he's going to find himself the head of a union that no longer has a league for its membership to ply their trade.
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billscarnage
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Joined: 27 Jun 2013
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

afdave wrote:
I think Soto just needs to realize that, the league is not in a position to be bargained against in this "tough agent" way. Yes, there are deep pockets involved now on the ownership level, but, the deep pockets are in the other coats they wear.... the AFL coat has extremely shallow pockets, and they aren't going to give you access to the other coat... if you push too hard, they'll just burn the AFL coat and walk away. You need to work with them to help make the pockets of the AFL coat deeper, and then you can have more to negotiate on.

This is 1/2 the reason I said there's a 100% chance there will be a 2018 season in the other thread. The league could bust the "union" like a pencil if it wanted. These aren't the rinky dink Neil's, Simmons, car salesmen, etc owners of the past.

I"m not going to knock Soto for doing what he's saying - that's what union heads are for - but they're just not in much of a position to try to strong arm the league.
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afdave
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly Bill.... especially since there are plenty of other leagues out there that can fill that niche.... if not of filling dates during the summer, at least of giving you more dates in general, and of having a place to "groom" people to eventually take positions in the main NBA and/or NHL organization. WNBA, NLL, various indoor soccer leagues, there was the announcement of the Pro Futsal League backed by Cuban, but, it's been very silent since that announcement.. and even the option of blowing up the AFL as it stands, and redoing it as a league closer to IFL or CIF in pay... which doesn't help the AFLPU at all.

So... work with what they got, make the league prosper again, and in 5-10 years it might get closer to what the 2000s were.
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Firstnten.net
Ironman

Joined: 23 Jun 2011
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

billscarnage wrote:

I"m not going to knock Soto for doing what he's saying - that's what union heads are for - but they're just not in much of a position to try to strong arm the league.


What benefit does it have for Soto to make threats via social media? It's retarded. If this is the only way for the AFLPU to communicate with the players they aren't worth the paper the CBA is written on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VrFV5r8cs0
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arenafannj40
 

Joined: 28 Sep 2017
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First post here... Been on the forums for the last few months, got interested in the possible expansion of the league Smile

This is a good sign or am I taking it out of context?

Ivan F. Soto‏
@ISotoAFLPU
Players work doesnt stop..late flt from Chi to Clt..another successful couple of Arbitration hearings. Our CBA is not a Joke, it is legit.
7:24 PM - 27 Sep 2017

-a
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Firstnten.net
Ironman

Joined: 23 Jun 2011
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

arenafannj40 wrote:
First post here... Been on the forums for the last few months, got interested in the possible expansion of the league Smile

This is a good sign or am I taking it out of context?

Ivan F. Soto‏
@ISotoAFLPU
Players work doesnt stop..late flt from Chi to Clt..another successful couple of Arbitration hearings. Our CBA is not a Joke, it is legit.
7:24 PM - 27 Sep 2017

-a


hard to say.

https://www.nlrb.gov/case/28-CA-201349

the documents are not open to the public yet they have to have some "redactions".

the allegations were.


8(a)(1) Concerted Activities (Retaliation, Discharge, Discipline)


8(a)(1) Coercive Rules

https://www.nlrb.gov/rights-we-protect/whats-law/employers/interfering-employee-rights-section-7-8a1

Reads like Soto and the AFLPU accused the AFL of trying to undermine the union. I'm thinking Soto is doing a good job of that on his own.


And today there was a dismissal letter. So it's hard to say who "won" or what the outcome was.


All you have to go by is how Soto conducts himself like when he hid union fees from the public and had a twitter war with Mook Williams over it.
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TargetToad
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gigisa wrote:
Black clouds coming in Sad

From Soto's Twitter
" Ivan F. Soto‏ @ISotoAFLPU 26 set
Strike power comes back in a week.."

Embarassed Rolling Eyes Embarassed

It won't matter, the best players (Joe Hills, Hippeard, Radenbaugh, SK, Toliver, etc.) will probably cross the picket lines before training camp/go to Arizona's and Jacksonville's farm leagues.
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AFLNerd36
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We'll probably have a 1-year interim deal to keep the AFL together, followed by a long-term CBA... and then expansion teams can and will join.
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TargetToad
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Last day :(
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Last edited by TargetToad on Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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TargetToad
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFLNerd36 wrote:
We'll probably have a 1-year interim deal to keep the AFL together, followed by a long-term CBA... and then expansion teams can and will join.

More like an endless stream of 1-year extensions, Ivan Soto being an all-around arse, and Buttera "allowing" (forcing) Philly to close up shop, and Bouche winning the NAL Championship perpetually by a score 999-0 via a Soular talent influx.

At least Joe Hills can extended his TD-streak by 1 million games while the Storm win a couple Arena Bowls over Cleveland, T.T. Toliver, Shane Carden, and a bunch of sub-AAL Northeastern teams.
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Last edited by TargetToad on Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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afdave
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Joined: 01 Jan 2001
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFLNerd36 wrote:
We'll probably have a 1-year interim deal to keep the AFL together, followed by a long-term CBA... and then expansion teams can and will join.


IMO, can't have another 5 team season.... interest was barely there this year... another "bridge" year, unless you are announcing 2019 teams in December of this year (maybe that keeps interest going), is going to be even more of a ghost town.

That might be the leverage Soto THINKS he does have.... that the owners are SO desperate to get things done with the players they'll agree to almost anything so they can get new owners on board ASAP.

Again, I, and I think many of us, believe that the 3 core NBA/NHL owners in the league right now are just as apt to shut it all down as to capitulate to the AFLPU's demands.
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mactheknife
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

afdave wrote:
Again, I, and I think many of us, believe that the 3 core NBA/NHL owners in the league right now are just as apt to shut it all down as to capitulate to the AFLPU's demands.


Yep. Every dollar they've lost on Arena Football is just another reason to pull the plug if Soto starts messing around. I wonder who'll buy up the intellectual property rights this time and pretend to be an extension of the original AFL...
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