The Home of Arena Football Fans since 1998

ArenaFan.com :: View topic - scottdale glendale
AlbumAlbum   FAQFAQ    SearchSearch  ProfileProfile  Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages  
scottdale glendale
Post new topic Reply to topic    ArenaFan.com Forum Index -> Expansion
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Bear124
Veteran

Joined: 29 Jul 2004
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:04 pm    Post subject: scottdale glendale Reply with quote

scottdale Glendale these two Arizona cities good for afl and ahl franchises
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
SackThe_Back
All Pro

Joined: 05 Jan 2018
Location: South Carolina
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Too far away. All the other teams are east coast.

You could maybeget an IFL franchise but that's it.
_________________
#Expansionseason

Romans 6:23
Atlantic City AFL team name ideas:
Atlantic City Aces; AC Rampage; AC Talons; AC SurfSharks;
AC Nets; NJ Express; NJ Metros; AC/NJ Marauders
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
TargetToad
Hall of Famer

Joined: 31 May 2017
Location: Lutz, FL
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:25 pm    Post subject: Re: scottdale glendale Reply with quote

Bear124 wrote:
scottdale Glendale these two Arizona cities good for afl and ahl franchises

Or that western league Tucson wants to start next year
_________________
I miss the Tampa Bay Storm
Back to top
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM Address
afdave
ArenaFan Staff

Joined: 01 Jan 2001
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess here is my problem with "Western league" when they talk about that is the much larger footprint you'd have to go to get enough teams.

I laid out a very "tight" 12 team "Northeast" AFL division in another thread... and the furthest two teams I think would be like Pittsburgh to Boston, which is a 9-hour bus ride... long, but, still doable.

I then laid out another 12 team "Midwest" AFL division, probably the longest apart in that was Minneapolis to Cleveland which is 11 hours... they might do a flight for that, but, most other trips would be drivable.

The issue with the "Western" league is that it is really more "Southwestern", maybe that is what you mean by "Western", and you aren't really including Seattle, Portland, Spokane, Boise, etc.

Let's say we are doing a "Western" league... now this isn't an "AFL" division and what we'd say the size requirements are for that (I'd say 70th or so and larger market size)... you can probably go down pretty low at the IFL/NAL level... probably 300k+ metro area size.

Distance wise, SLC is around a 10 hour drive from Phoenix, which I think is the "hub" of this "Southwest" league, so, that is the furthest team. Based on that, you would want to go around 6 hours in any direction from Phoenix east/west, so those furthest east/west teams have around a 12 hour drive to each other at most.

That gets you to around Bakersfield going west, and Albuquerque and El Paso going east.

So, what markets are reasonable in that area:
* (Phoenix) Arizona Rattlers
* "Inland Empire", CA (kind of "L.A. far suburbs area", but, 4+m people and 13th ranked metro area in its own right)
* San Diego (17th)
* Las Vegas (29th)
* Salt Lake City (48th)
* Tuscon (53rd, really around the size of Buffalo, which has TWO Major League teams... Buffalo really only has their "ML" teams because of "history" more than any league would actually put a new team there now).
* Albuquerque (60th)
* Bakersfield, CA (62nd)

So, what I'll say to here is that, if the AFL eventually wanted to go "west" and get AZ back, and they are OK with anything "Albany" (63rd) or larger... you have 8 teams right there above.

* El Paso (68th)

Honestly, there isn't a lot more "southwest" that is 300k+ then. So, you are at 9 or 10 markets. Which, I guess an 8 or 9 team league is better than the IFL or NAL are at this point, so, the "Rattlers League" that was very compact around them, if they could find owners, would make a lot more sense for them. And really, they are playing already some very lowly "sounding" markets (Nebraska, Sioux Falls, etc)... actually having "San Diego", "Las Vegas", "Utah", etc would be an upgrade for them.
_________________
Play FREE Online Trivia for Prizes, CLICK HERE!

Arenafan on Twitter | Arenafan on Facebook
Back to top
View user's profileSend private messageAIM AddressYahoo Messenger
AFLNerd36
All Pro

Joined: 19 Jun 2016
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

afdave wrote:
I guess here is my problem with "Western league" when they talk about that is the much larger footprint you'd have to go to get enough teams.

I laid out a very "tight" 12 team "Northeast" AFL division in another thread... and the furthest two teams I think would be like Pittsburgh to Boston, which is a 9-hour bus ride... long, but, still doable.

I then laid out another 12 team "Midwest" AFL division, probably the longest apart in that was Minneapolis to Cleveland which is 11 hours... they might do a flight for that, but, most other trips would be drivable.

The issue with the "Western" league is that it is really more "Southwestern", maybe that is what you mean by "Western", and you aren't really including Seattle, Portland, Spokane, Boise, etc.

Let's say we are doing a "Western" league... now this isn't an "AFL" division and what we'd say the size requirements are for that (I'd say 70th or so and larger market size)... you can probably go down pretty low at the IFL/NAL level... probably 300k+ metro area size.

Distance wise, SLC is around a 10 hour drive from Phoenix, which I think is the "hub" of this "Southwest" league, so, that is the furthest team. Based on that, you would want to go around 6 hours in any direction from Phoenix east/west, so those furthest east/west teams have around a 12 hour drive to each other at most.

That gets you to around Bakersfield going west, and Albuquerque and El Paso going east.

So, what markets are reasonable in that area:
* (Phoenix) Arizona Rattlers
* "Inland Empire", CA (kind of "L.A. far suburbs area", but, 4+m people and 13th ranked metro area in its own right)
* San Diego (17th)
* Las Vegas (29th)
* Salt Lake City (48th)
* Tuscon (53rd, really around the size of Buffalo, which has TWO Major League teams... Buffalo really only has their "ML" teams because of "history" more than any league would actually put a new team there now).
* Albuquerque (60th)
* Bakersfield, CA (62nd)

So, what I'll say to here is that, if the AFL eventually wanted to go "west" and get AZ back, and they are OK with anything "Albany" (63rd) or larger... you have 8 teams right there above.

* El Paso (68th)

Honestly, there isn't a lot more "southwest" that is 300k+ then. So, you are at 9 or 10 markets. Which, I guess an 8 or 9 team league is better than the IFL or NAL are at this point, so, the "Rattlers League" that was very compact around them, if they could find owners, would make a lot more sense for them. And really, they are playing already some very lowly "sounding" markets (Nebraska, Sioux Falls, etc)... actually having "San Diego", "Las Vegas", "Utah", etc would be an upgrade for them.


You might want to consider adding Denver/Loveland, and then you would have 10 teams....
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
TargetToad
Hall of Famer

Joined: 31 May 2017
Location: Lutz, FL
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFLNerd36 wrote:
afdave wrote:
I guess here is my problem with "Western league" when they talk about that is the much larger footprint you'd have to go to get enough teams.

I laid out a very "tight" 12 team "Northeast" AFL division in another thread... and the furthest two teams I think would be like Pittsburgh to Boston, which is a 9-hour bus ride... long, but, still doable.

I then laid out another 12 team "Midwest" AFL division, probably the longest apart in that was Minneapolis to Cleveland which is 11 hours... they might do a flight for that, but, most other trips would be drivable.

The issue with the "Western" league is that it is really more "Southwestern", maybe that is what you mean by "Western", and you aren't really including Seattle, Portland, Spokane, Boise, etc.

Let's say we are doing a "Western" league... now this isn't an "AFL" division and what we'd say the size requirements are for that (I'd say 70th or so and larger market size)... you can probably go down pretty low at the IFL/NAL level... probably 300k+ metro area size.

Distance wise, SLC is around a 10 hour drive from Phoenix, which I think is the "hub" of this "Southwest" league, so, that is the furthest team. Based on that, you would want to go around 6 hours in any direction from Phoenix east/west, so those furthest east/west teams have around a 12 hour drive to each other at most.

That gets you to around Bakersfield going west, and Albuquerque and El Paso going east.

So, what markets are reasonable in that area:
* (Phoenix) Arizona Rattlers
* "Inland Empire", CA (kind of "L.A. far suburbs area", but, 4+m people and 13th ranked metro area in its own right)
* San Diego (17th)
* Las Vegas (29th)
* Salt Lake City (48th)
* Tuscon (53rd, really around the size of Buffalo, which has TWO Major League teams... Buffalo really only has their "ML" teams because of "history" more than any league would actually put a new team there now).
* Albuquerque (60th)
* Bakersfield, CA (62nd)

So, what I'll say to here is that, if the AFL eventually wanted to go "west" and get AZ back, and they are OK with anything "Albany" (63rd) or larger... you have 8 teams right there above.

* El Paso (68th)

Honestly, there isn't a lot more "southwest" that is 300k+ then. So, you are at 9 or 10 markets. Which, I guess an 8 or 9 team league is better than the IFL or NAL are at this point, so, the "Rattlers League" that was very compact around them, if they could find owners, would make a lot more sense for them. And really, they are playing already some very lowly "sounding" markets (Nebraska, Sioux Falls, etc)... actually having "San Diego", "Las Vegas", "Utah", etc would be an upgrade for them.


You might want to consider adding Denver/Loveland, and then you would have 10 teams....
dont forget Las Cruces, NM even if it is only 100k and somehow lumped into El Paso's metro despite being across state lines and a 45 minute drive on I-10 through literal desert.
_________________
I miss the Tampa Bay Storm
Back to top
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM Address
afdave
ArenaFan Staff

Joined: 01 Jan 2001
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Denver is honestly a bit outside of that "12 hour drive from edge to edge" goal for a league and to be "centered" on Phoenix... if you make Phoenix the "left side" then maybe, but, you'd lose the California teams and Vegas/SLC most likely, and need to look into Texas, OK, CO, Nebraska.

I did include El Paso, which would include Las Cruses.
_________________
Play FREE Online Trivia for Prizes, CLICK HERE!

Arenafan on Twitter | Arenafan on Facebook
Back to top
View user's profileSend private messageAIM AddressYahoo Messenger
AFLNerd36
All Pro

Joined: 19 Jun 2016
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

afdave wrote:
Denver is honestly a bit outside of that "12 hour drive from edge to edge" goal for a league and to be "centered" on Phoenix... if you make Phoenix the "left side" then maybe, but, you'd lose the California teams and Vegas/SLC most likely, and need to look into Texas, OK, CO, Nebraska.

I did include El Paso, which would include Las Cruses.


What about a 14-16 hour bus ride range?
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
afdave
ArenaFan Staff

Joined: 01 Jan 2001
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFLNerd36 wrote:
afdave wrote:
Denver is honestly a bit outside of that "12 hour drive from edge to edge" goal for a league and to be "centered" on Phoenix... if you make Phoenix the "left side" then maybe, but, you'd lose the California teams and Vegas/SLC most likely, and need to look into Texas, OK, CO, Nebraska.

I did include El Paso, which would include Las Cruses.


What about a 14-16 hour bus ride range?


Which I guess Bakersfield to Denver would be... that is a LONG bus ride, but, doable I guess. At some point though you are losing the point of 'travel compactness', but, the "west" is much more spread out in its metro areas than the East, so, that is the issue.
_________________
Play FREE Online Trivia for Prizes, CLICK HERE!

Arenafan on Twitter | Arenafan on Facebook
Back to top
View user's profileSend private messageAIM AddressYahoo Messenger
crixus
Starter

Joined: 20 Jun 2015
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SackThe_Back wrote:
Too far away. All the other teams are east coast.

You could maybeget an IFL franchise but that's it.


I agree with you that they're too far away for the AFL. But they won't even be considered for the IFL because the Rattlers are already in Phoenix. And Scottsdale and Glendale are part of the Phoenix metro area (next door cities).
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
billscarnage
MVP

Joined: 27 Jun 2013
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

crixus wrote:
SackThe_Back wrote:
Too far away. All the other teams are east coast.

You could maybeget an IFL franchise but that's it.


I agree with you that they're too far away for the AFL. But they won't even be considered for the IFL because the Rattlers are already in Phoenix. And Scottsdale and Glendale are part of the Phoenix metro area (next door cities).

Not to mention Scottsdale doesn't have an arena.
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
ProwlerGirl
 

Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Location: Kissimmee, FL
PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2018 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, I just heard from a pretty reliable source, that this is in fact a likely place. Glendale that is.

The Arena in Glendale where they had ArenaBowl XXIX is looking for a tenant and I have heard that there are some interested parties looking to put a team in there.

I found out because someone was fishing for a name.

What do you think they will name it?

If I had a vote I would offer:
Phoenix Firebirds (pretty generic I know, but I'm not creative)
Glendale Gila Monsters (My favorite one)

Anyone else have some ideas?
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
TargetToad
Hall of Famer

Joined: 31 May 2017
Location: Lutz, FL
PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2018 4:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ProwlerGirl wrote:
Actually, I just heard from a pretty reliable source, that this is in fact a likely place. Glendale that is.

The Arena in Glendale where they had ArenaBowl XXIX is looking for a tenant and I have heard that there are some interested parties looking to put a team in there.

I found out because someone was fishing for a name.

What do you think they will name it?

If I had a vote I would offer:
Phoenix Firebirds (pretty generic I know, but I'm not creative)
Glendale Gila Monsters (My favorite one)

Anyone else have some ideas?

Phoenix Phoenix vs Buffalo Buffalo
_________________
I miss the Tampa Bay Storm
Back to top
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM Address
ProwlerGirl
 

Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Location: Kissimmee, FL
PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think I'm going to create a new post for just name suggestions. It'll be fun!
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
afdave
ArenaFan Staff

Joined: 01 Jan 2001
PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2018 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Better TT:

Phoenix Buffalo vs. Buffalo Phoenix
_________________
Play FREE Online Trivia for Prizes, CLICK HERE!

Arenafan on Twitter | Arenafan on Facebook
Back to top
View user's profileSend private messageAIM AddressYahoo Messenger
Big Mike
Starter

Joined: 28 Mar 2017
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ProwlerGirl wrote:
Actually, I just heard from a pretty reliable source, that this is in fact a likely place. Glendale that is.

The Arena in Glendale where they had ArenaBowl XXIX is looking for a tenant and I have heard that there are some interested parties looking to put a team in there.

I found out because someone was fishing for a name.

What do you think they will name it?

If I had a vote I would offer:
Phoenix Firebirds (pretty generic I know, but I'm not creative)
Glendale Gila Monsters (My favorite one)

Anyone else have some ideas?
Ron Jaworski mentioned Arizona in a recent television interview. Maybe someone is interested in operating an AFL team in Glendale.
Back to top
View user's profileSend private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic Reply to topic    ArenaFan.com Forum Index -> Expansion View previous topic :: View next topic  
 

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group